Wisdom brightens a person's face and changes its hard appearance. -Ecclesiatstes 8:1

Thursday, January 13, 2011

Which is Smarter?

Paying down the rest of our debt and putting only a minimum in savings. (Dave Ramsey Baby Step 2)


Going back to paying minimums on debt while stashing away all the extra cash in savings in order to pay for an adoption that a may or may not happen in a year’s time.


We have 2 credit card debts left and if we throw all our extra income toward those debts we should be debt free by year’s end.

We will be Home Study approved by the end of January and will soon sign on with an agency. Adoption requires money in increments throughout the process PLUS the time off work (we both work and we both HAVE to work) with a new baby/child.

If we can pay off our debt by the end of the year but don’t have money in savings to cover the adoption cost and time off of work, then we can’t accept any adoption scenarios that might come our way. (However, this is wishful thinking because there is a good chance that no matches will be made until a year or longer down the road.)

If we were to take our extra cash and save it while just paying minimums on our debt, we wouldn’t be debt free for at least another year, but we would have the cash to cover adoption expenses and at least 2 months off of work for one of us.

So which is the smarter choice?

Think about it this way…if I were pregnant and had 9 months to either save cash for a baby or pay off my debt, which would be the best choice?


Jay said...

Buying children is beyond unethical

Jay said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Blake said...

Okay, I get your point, though I'm not sure that it does me any good.

Jay said...

So you don't care about being unethical?

Blake said...

I am not buying a child. I understand why you say that. I hate that it cost as much as it does to go through the adoption process. But as I've been told over and over, you aren't paying for the child, you are paying for the services of the agencies, lawyers, and state services that are required in order to bring a child into a loving home. Please don't accuse me of being unethical when you know nothing of who I am.

Jay said...

I don't need to know who you are to know that thinking you have a right to pretend someone else's child is yours is unethical

Kathy said...

Just ignore Jay's comments. I would delete them and block him if you can. No sense it getting negative feedback like that.

We have done Dave Ramsey, and we have struggled to adhere to his principles while trying to adopt. Just today we found our adoption costs will once again go much higher than we expected. It has been ridiculous.

It is a hard call. I know you will be better off if you are debt free, and you likely will have some more time to save up some money.

Good luck to you!

Jay said...

Kathy, You don't think its important for prospective adoptive parents to listen to what adult adoptees have to say?

Meg said...

Obviously "JAY" knows nothing about Adoption and is in no position to give his/her opinion.

Blake, you are better off letting his/her negative energy flow right by you...and focus on the positive in your life, which is becoming a family with your "meant-to-be" husband and your soon-to-be child.

And just in case you feel the need to respond to that ignorant Jay person, please feel free to tell him/her that the $$$ we spend on adoption is for retaining an agency or lawyer to do marketing and advertising for birth moms, administrative work, legal proceedings, home-studies, background checks, finger printing, etc. to make sure we have the mental, physical and material means by which to provide for a child.
There is no "buying" of a birth mom's services and/or buying of a baby/child.
And, by the way, giving birth to a baby the old fashioned way would cost about the same amount of $$$ if one did not have insurance and there were no complications.
'Jay' needs to become a bit more familiar with the FACTS of adoption before commenting on things he/she clearly knows nothing about.
Meanwhile, keep your eye on the prize, *smile* your child could show up in your life a lot more quickly than you think.

Jay said...


I am adopted

Anonymous said...

Jay, what about all the children placed for adoption - no family whatsoever - they need, deserve, a home. Should they stay in "the system" - stay on the streets - not knowing the love of family when there are so many out their willing to open their hearts and homes to these kids? No. They should not.

Jay said...


Most children could stay in their families of origin if those families were given more support.

For those that can't adoption still isn't the right answer. you can still take a child in, love them and look after them without pretending they are related to you.

Anonymous said...

Jay, it appears that you had a negative experience as an adoptee and for that I am sorry. That is not your fault. And the good news is that as an adult you can make the choice to be loved, loving toward others, and happy. I hope you do that and let residual anger slip away. Peace.

Jay said...

Anonymous what are you talking about? where have I said anything about having negative experiences?

I have lots of people in my life who I love and who love me. that doesn't change the fact that adoption is inherently unethical and cased by inequality

Kristin said...

Jay....wow....don't you think judging someone like myself who can not have a biological child is unethical. Either put yourself in our shoes or back off. Unethical....grow up.

Blake said...

Jay, It has been suggested that I block you, but I believe you have the freedom to speak your mind. Such is the point of blogs. I noticed that you've started a new blog on adoption. Do you mind posting a blog about why you think it is unethical and steering everyone over there for comments? I really did want some opinions on my original blog topics and I think a post on your blog with your opinions would get a lot of traffic and attention.

Jay said...

Kristen no I don't, you are not the only person in the world who can not have a biological child.

I am infertile as well. I know it hurts but that doesn't make adoption okay.

Also it sucks for adoptees to know they are second best, to know their adoptive parents would have had bio kids if they could have done.

Anonymous said...

What is the right answer though Jay when no one is there to step in when there is no parent/family to step in? My son did not have any options - wish it had been true - for him. I was in a position to give him a loving home - there is no pretending on our part - I love him, with all my heart, and would give my life for him. I don't pretend - on any level that he is my biological son - he is simply my son and because of the legalities he will be entitled to benefits he would otherwise not have. Yes - there are, sadly, unethical practices going on out there which sickens me. I stop and give pause often to think where he would be in the orphanage or on the streets - I am glad our paths crossed and would go through the process all over again. Be well.

Jay said...


Pretty much my whole blog is going to be about why adoption is unethical. I can't really write just one post on it because it's a big subject but if people want to watch my blog posts will go up as and when.

And people who are set on adopting should really be reading and listening to adult adoptees, even the ones that are saying things they don't want to hear.

Katherine said...

My sister and I are adopted and call it what you will ... we have had an amazing life and thank God every day for the life we were given by our PARENTS. Yes, they adopted us ... but make no mistake, they are our PARENTS.

They put band-aids on our scrapes, sat up with us when we were sick, took pictures of us at our graduations, paid for and supported our educations, and walked me down the aisle at my wedding. Most of all though ... they loved us as we grew into adults and continue to do so today.

It breaks my heart that you didn't have the same experience, but please ... that doesn't give you the right to judge others who take part in adoption simply because your experience was less-than-par. Time and energy is much better spent healing within rather than tearing down others.

Ryan said...

Blake, I don't think you can quite compare it to being pregnant and expecting in 9 months when it comes to the cost, simply because the majority of us just know that there will be added expenses when the baby gets here, but we don't have the huge lump-sum cost associated with an adoption and most of us do not hurry to pay off debts before the baby gets here. I think I can safely say "most of us" based on the percentage of people who are in debt.

Having said that, I think it may be a good option for you to back down to minimums on the credit cards and save until you have the money you need for the adoption. After you have it saved, if you still have not adopted, then you can let that money sit and start hitting the cards again to pay them off. If, for whatever reason, it comes to pass that you guys do not end up adopting (this is purely hypothetical), then you have that lump sum saved that you can use to pay off remaining debts. Sure you will lose the money you paid on interest not paying the debts off sooner, but the cost may be worth the peace of mind that you have the funds to go through the adoption once a match is made.

Good luck. Tough decisions, I'm sure.

Anonymous said...

I am sorry that you had such a negative experience on your blog.

But I would also add that it is one you could perhaps learn from.

As an adoptive parent myself, I was at first astounded by all of the negativity regarding adoption that comes from so many adult adoptees. And I, too, labeled it as a bad experience. But by being dismissive of them, you lose the opportunity to gain an additional perspective. A perspective your adopted child may one day share.

To an adoptive parent, adoption is a joyful, wonderful blessing. To a birth parent, adoption is a tragedy that will impact them in one way or another for the rest of their lives. For an adoptee, even one who goes to a loving, nurturing home, adoption leads to mixed emotions. While they may love their adoptive family, you cannot deny that they have experienced the lose of their family of origin. Depending upon the individual, this may be a difficult burden.

As adoptive parents, we need to be open to hearing all of these perspectives in order to help us be prepared to listen to what our children one day have to say. To be open to their emotions and feelings and to assure them what they are feeling is not a betrayal to us, their adoptive parents. Because the reality is that sometimes, even in a positive situation, be adopted sucks.

In addition, as adoptive parents it is important that we recognize that there are times that extremely unethical things happen in both international and domestic adoptions. For the most part, they happen because of the amount of money involved. Adoption is a multi-billion dollar industry. We, as adoptive parents, should be aware of this and join in the fight to prevent it. Because it is our money that is fueling it.

Good luck with your adoption efforts.